In this episode, Brian continues his conversation with Brian James McMahon, founder of Church WellCo, diving deeper into why we resist communal formation and how we can learn to attach to one another in healthy, vulnerable ways. They unpack the tension between our desire for connection and our instinct for self-preservation, explore the spiritual practice of lament and confession, and show why slowing down together may be the very thing that sustains movement over time.

Brian sits down with therapist and church coach BrianJames McMahon to ask a disarming question: “Which Jesus did you meet?” From Genesis 2, “not good to be alone”, to the disciples asking “Who is this?” they explore why formation requires people, not just private devotion. This is a kickoff to a short mini-series on disciple-making in community and rupture & repair.

Brian and Cory have a candid, practical discussion on the call to return to simplicity. Movements don’t grow by adding complexity; they grow by pruning. Using the “8.5x11 One-Page Rule,” they show how to distill trainings, gatherings, and even family discipleship into what’s essential and reproducible—so anyone can pass it on anywhere (including a prison where no materials are allowed).

In this final video of the series on planting the gospel incarnationally, we learn why one of the most powerful tools for mission starts inside: learning to gospel yourself daily. Drawing on Jeff Vanderstelt’s Gospel Fluency, Fruit-to-Root, and the Four G’s (from Saturate), this episode reframes the gospel as good news for everyday life, moving us from unbelief to belief in Jesus in every area—so it naturally overflows to others.

In this episode, Dori, a disciple maker in the San Francisco Bay Area, introduces the Discovery Bible Study (DBS) model. DBS is a simple, reproducible way of gathering people around Scripture that emphasizes discovery over teaching and obedience over knowledge. Through the three-thirds process, look back, look up, and look forward, groups learn, obey, and multiply without requiring an expert leader.

Breanna Wiebe introduces The Story Diamond, a simple gospel tool that helps us move from whatever dominant story we’re living (career, comfort, romance, success) into Jesus’ better story. By reading Scripture as one coherent narrative—with Jesus at the center—we’re invited to be formed by the Spirit, in community, and for everyday mission.

In this episode, Haley Miller, director of Zero Hour Student Ministries, shares how high school students are being awakened and unleashed as everyday disciple-makers on their campuses. With Gen Z known as the first truly post-Christian generation in U.S. history, the need for repeated opportunities to see and respond to the gospel has never been greater. Haley introduces the FROG Questions—a simple, practical tool to help students build trust, spark meaningful conversations, and create safe spaces where gospel conversations naturally emerge.

In this episode, we explore the messy, complex, and often misunderstood work of evangelism. Through a personal story of encountering deep resistance to the gospel, we’re reminded that sharing Jesus is rarely a one-time event. Instead, people often move through a journey of thresholds before entering the Kingdom. Drawing from Doug Schaupp and Don Everts’ Five Thresholds of Postmodern Conversion, we discover a framework that helps disciple-makers meet people where they are and love them forward one step at a time.

In this episode, Rob Wegner discusses the significance of clear and reproducible gospel language within the context of microchurches. He emphasizes the centrality of the gospel in the life of believers, illustrating how it serves as a transformative power and a new operating system for engaging with life. Wegner introduces the concept of fractals in faith, suggesting that simplicity in the gospel can lead to profound understanding and disciple-making. He also shares insights on the 'saved wholes gospel' and the importance of integrating the gospel into all aspects of life.

In this episode, we introduce how microchurches plant the gospel incarnationally within their context. Grounded in the conviction that “the gospel is the power of God for salvation,” Brian walks through the Missionary Pathway—a five-phase framework rooted in global disciple-making movements. This series equips ordinary people with practical tools to embody, demonstrate, and proclaim the good news in everyday life.

In this episode, Brian and Cory wrap up this series around the Upside Down Kingdom and share insights from the past several episodes. We discuss the concept of greatness in the kingdom of God, emphasizing that true leadership is rooted in servanthood and familial relationships. The conversation explores the challenges of multiplication and the importance of identity in leadership, as well as practical examples of how to develop leaders in a way that reflects the values of the kingdom.

In this episode, Brian and Cory interview Tim Jore and Jesse Griffin as we explore the themes of leadership, church structure, and the role of the church as a family. Tim and Jesse have written extensively about how we view leadership in the church and the necessity of understanding what the original authors of the New Testament were communicating to us about how we lead the church in a modern context.

In this episode, Brian and Cory interview Neil Cole and delve into the themes of leadership, church movements, and the importance of relationships over hierarchical structures. They discuss the fear of chaos in leadership, the need for authenticity and vulnerability, and the transformative power of love in the Kingdom of God. Neil shares his personal journey of faith and the lessons learned through years of silence and dependence on Christ. The conversation emphasizes the need for a decentralized approach to church leadership that empowers individuals and fosters genuine community.

In this episode, Brian and Cory sit down with movement veteran and KC-based mentor Roy Moran to unpack the tension between leadership and celebrity, influence and humility. Drawing from his own journey and global experiences, Roy shares how following Jesus meant stepping out of the spotlight, deconstructing hierarchy, and embracing a leadership posture that multiplies rather than centralizes. You’ll hear how titles, ego, and platform can stall movements—and how ordinary people are fueling extraordinary Kingdom growth.

In this episode, Cory and Brian interview Alan Hirsch and explore the dynamics of kingdom movements, emphasizing the importance of decentralized leadership and the dangers of centralized power structures. We discuss the significance of metaphors in understanding movements, the cultural implications of fame in leadership, and practical insights for ordinary disciple makers. We also highlight the need for a shift from consumer-driven church models to organic, community-focused movements that prioritize discipleship and service.

• In Part 2 of our conversation with Nadim Costa, we dive deeper into what leadership looks like in the margins. Nadim speaks candidly about the Western church’s addiction to platform, credentials, and strategy—and contrasts it with movements fueled by raw obedience, radical availability, and extraordinary compassion. With stories of disciple-makers emerging from communities with disabilities, to ordinary believers shifting culture in their neighborhoods, Nadim reminds us that true leadership in the kingdom is forged in obscurity, not spotlight.

• In part one of this two-part episode, Cory and Brian interview Nadim Costa who shares his profound journey from Lebanon's civil war to a dynamic faith in Christ. He discusses the paradoxes of leadership in the context of the Upside Down Kingdom, emphasizing that God often chooses the unlikely over the powerful. Through transformative stories and encounters, Nadim illustrates how God is moving in unexpected ways, particularly in the Middle East, and challenges listeners to embrace a faith that is interactive and alive.

• In this episode, Cory and Brian are joined by Rob Wegner to dig deep into a foundational tension in the Church: the clash between Western, platform-driven leadership and the Jesus-shaped model of obscurity, servanthood, and decentralization. With stories from India, megachurch stages, and the margins of society, they challenge listeners to reconsider what kind of leadership truly multiplies the gospel.

• ​​In this opening episode, Brian and Cory cast vision for this new series on where we will explore the radical invitation of Jesus to lead in a way that flips everything upside-down. While Western models of leadership often chase platform, power, and personality, Jesus modeled something entirely different: surrender, service, and spiritual authority rooted in love. We explore key biblical passages—Mark 10, Philippians 2, and John 13—and show how this isn’t just theory. It’s how movements are actually growing today, from underground networks in the Global South to ordinary disciple-makers in places like Kansas City.

• In this episode of the Kansas City Underground podcast, Brian and Cory interview Justin Nkundabagenzi from Rwanda, discussing his journey from experiencing the Rwandan genocide to becoming a mobilizer of disciple makers. The conversation explores the importance of prayer, the transition from traditional church models to disciple-making movements, and the current state of the movement in Rwanda, highlighting the significant growth and impact of ordinary people spreading the gospel. Justin emphasizes the need for dependence on the Holy Spirit and the importance of leadership development in sustaining the movement.